Andrew Ellard (I'm Not With Him) interview
Starring comedian Hils Barker alongside Torchwood's Tom Price and Red Dwarf's Chris Barrie and Hattie Hayridge, new radio sitcom pilot I'm Not With Him is written by Andrew Ellard, script editor for the latest IT Crowd and associate producer of the recent Red Dwarf revival.
> Listen to a clip.
What’s I'm Not With Him about?
“It’s about a guy and a girl who share a flat. But they know each other too well, they’ve been stuck together too long - they’re in their late 20s and single, but can’t escape the appearance of being a long-term, snippy couple.”
Where did you get the idea and how long have you been working on the project?
“You take all these things from life, I think. I did live - platonically - with a female friend for a couple of years. Pretty soon your friends start inviting you both to things, even though they don’t know one of you that well. “Oh, and you’ll bring Andrew, obviously”, like you’re married, the default plus-one.
“Hopefully it has a bit of that know-each-other-well rhythm in the dialogue, that snap of being a little too in-synch. Barry and Linda also share a vocabulary, their own style of exclamation/swearing that the other characters don’t use.
“It’s been with a couple of companies since I first wrote the pilot. Lots of development, but never went all the way. You always have things like that, gestating somewhere - but this one was actually my first sale so it has a bit of extra meaning. For me. Not for anyone with actual perspective.”
Do you find it exciting that it’s now possible to produce and distribute a production independently like this?
“It’s fascinating. I’m still figuring it out, so this is just a nervous toe in the water. But just the idea that you can get a project - something a cast and crew are passionate enough about - out there, seen by people, is exciting.
“The downside is that there’s no real gimmick to the show. It’s a pretty mainstream, fun half-hour - it’s ‘about something’, but it’s not edgy or quick-fix-y in a way that means it’s likely to go viral. It’s hard to imagine it getting passed around the way a funny YouTube clip of a Yahtzee-playing dog does.
“I probably wouldn’t have done it at all if not for Hils Barker, who plays Linda. I’d been script editor on a comedy script Hils was developing for Paul Jackson - a brilliant, and most definitely edgy, thing that I really hope some commissioner finds and picks up - and watching her do her character comedy performances made me realise I’d found someone who could make Linda work. Suddenly it became a case of having to make the blasted thing. I got my dander up, which isn’t a pretty sight.”
How did you get the rest of the cast together (including Torchwood's Tom Price, and Red Dwarf's Chris Barrie and Hattie Hayridge)?
“Tom came from Hils. The two of them, as a pair, are really what makes the show work, and Tom was her suggestion. She’d known him from the stand-up circuit, and when they got in they just found this immediate chemistry. I think it comes from them having shared lengthy car journeys together - they just knew how to snap at each other. It was great, although everyone then assumed they’d been secretly rehearsing!
“The Red Dwarf side was... well, I don’t want to say ‘easy’, so I’ll say it ‘wasn’t hard’. I’d worked on and around the franchise for a long time so I think - I hope - they trust me. I dropped Chris and Hattie emails begging pretty hard, told them there was no money, and they couldn’t resist.
“In truth I suppose the script is what did it - I’m not very persuasive, so I guess the smart thing was to not suggest anything until I felt I had something decent for them. I also rewrote, gave those characters more substance and better gags.
“That’s my Big Bit Of Advice, actually. Write every part as if you are, at some point, going to have to pitch it to a favourite performer. That lights a hell of a fire under you when you rewrite.”
You were script editor on the last series of The IT Crowd and you’re also writing for Series 5 - how far along is Series 5 and can you give us any hints about what to expect?
“It’s a long way before filming yet, it’s still being written. ‘Conceptualised’, really - getting ideas and story shapes together.
“It’s the first series Graham’s done with a writing staff, and we’re in a virtual ‘writers room’ online. He’s been very good at guiding us to working in his style - aiming towards big, funny set-piece ideas and keeping the show’s unique voice. So that’s the hint, I guess: I’ve no doubt there will be big funny stuff, and the tone will be absolutely consistent. It’s still totally Graham’s show, we’re just paddling in his pool.”
You were also associate producer of 2009’s Red Dwarf revival for Dave. What were the specials like to work on and did you feel any pressure with such a long time having passed since Series 8?
“I didn’t feel any pressure at all - it was all on Doug Naylor! I was script editing as well and, story-wise, that long break between series was kind of a gift. It allowed us to ignore the cliffhanger - it was a new audience, so we pretty much had to - and just get on with telling a new story.
“It was a tough shoot for everyone - the budget was low so there was a lot of doubling-up of workloads. You’d find Doug working rubber tentacles himself to get an effects shot, one producer was also working as first AD. I was directing the ‘Making Of’ documentaries and looking after our end of the publicity and marketing in between stuff for the main shows. By any stretch the finished shows were an extraordinary achievement given the resources.
“My favourite single thing that happened was a script chat with Doug where I mumbled something about how Lister, while down on his luck, might find a world he can totally control pretty appealing. Would he even want to go back to reality? That theme’s appeared in the show before, of course... but when we got the next draft Doug had invented this heart-churning new ending: Kochanski returned, Lister battled for his soul. Just gorgeous.
“Things like that - or the day I pitched Katerina getting dispatched by a moving vehicle - are the best part of the job. A showrunner takes the notion and spins it into something brilliant.”
Was there ever any temptation to film the specials in front of a studio audience or include a laughter track?
“More than a temptation - early drafts and early schedules were fully planning on a live audience shoot! But we couldn’t afford to do it. Out of that, I think, came rewrites that pushed the show to a more dramatic area - we got confident enough to do that.
“That said, it’s a fallacy that audience comedy can’t also do strong drama. Dwarf’s done some touching stuff. Roseanne was amazing for playing blazing rows live. We could have made a live audience gasp and hold their breath - that would have been pretty cool.”
Which is your favourite of the original 8 series and why?
“Series three. With a bullet. Some of that’s nostalgia - when it first aired I was doodling polymorphs and Starbugs on school books - but mostly I think, writing-wise, it does pretty much everything right. Strong character work, great gags, wonderful high-concepts, and the first bump up of the production values.
“An episode like Bodyswap is rarely cited, but it’s a perfect example of Red Dwarf - no guest baddies, just a bunch of contrasting characters getting themselves into the kind of trouble only science fiction (or fantasy) can do.”
How did you first get involved with working on Red Dwarf?
“Oh, we go way back. I was a fan first - proud runner-up, Rimmer costume, 1993. There are photos.
“Eventually I edited the club magazine, from that I came on to write web content for Grant Naylor, then I was directing and overseeing the DVD content - I’m stupidly proud that we’re rare among TV shows for having really in-depth, lengthy documentaries covering the making of every series, every episode.
“So it’s been with me my entire adult life. Which probably says more about me than I‘d like...”
You were a Script Consultant on the long-rumoured Red Dwarf: The Movie - do you think this project will still happen one day?
“As a movie my gut says no. Or, at least, not this ‘generation’. The TV revival on Dave seems to be the new life for the show now. Just observing it, the movie seemed to end up being a case of ‘recast or don’t make it’, and right now those actors are those characters.
“The film script was great, though, and I really hope it gets released done day. It was a reboot of the series - just as the novels were, a parallel universe - so most of what was great about it wouldn’t adapt easily to the TV series. But it’d make a knockout graphic novel.”
Craig Charles has confirmed that two new series of Red Dwarf are being produced, with filming starting in January 2011 - is this still the case?
“He didn’t confirm it so much as mention the call he’d had most recently from GNP regarding his availability! Latest word is that the deals are being done and - assuming UKTV get it sorted - they’ll be in a position to start prepping before the end of the year. But I think it’s just one series of six episodes... right now.”
What else have you got coming up?
“Right now I’m locked away in a hotel plotting an indie horror-thriller for Workshop Productions. And I’m script editing on a few things, including Life Of Riley for BBC One - which is a show seriously lacking in both spaceships and nerds. I intend to correct these oversights.”
Iʼm Not With Him is now available as a free podcast from iTunes or direct from Andrew's website.
> Buy the Red Dwarf: Back To Earth DVD on Amazon.
> Follow Andrew on Twitter.
